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JACQUELYN HALL:

So you organized an interracial student group at Lynchburg College.

HOWARD KESTER:

I certainly did.

JACQUELYN HALL:

Was that . . .

HOWARD KESTER:

That was the first one in the South.

JACQUELYN HALL:

Was that a YMCA?

HOWARD KESTER:

Well, it was composed of students of Lynchburg, Randolph Macon, and Lynchburg Theological Seminary and College, which was a Negro institution, and as soon as I came back from Europe, well, when I saw the ghettos in Warsaw and Krakow, particularly Krakow, you know the Jews had to be in by sundown and there was a tremendous chain, larger than a regular 109 chain, clear across the gates, and every Jew had to be inside that before sundown. And when I saw it something turned over inside of me, and I came to feel that - "Well, by golly, this is what we do to Negroes in the South. We put them in restrictive areas, and exploit them in every way that we can think of." And I felt that the time had come for Negro and white students to get together, and I went over to see one of the students . . . no, I spoke, I spoke at the College, and afterwards met a man by the name of Jackson. He was studying for the Ministry just as I was, and I liked him, and trusted him, and vice versa. And we began talking about the formation of a student group, and at first we met over at the Negro college, because in those days it was hard to find a white college that would welcome us, and so . . . Is this what you want?

JACQUELYN HALL:

Yes, I want the story.

HOWARD KESTER:

And then the Negro students said we ought to meet in a mutual place, and

JACQUELYN HALL:

Rather than meeting at the black college?

HOWARD KESTER:

Yes.

JACQUELYN HALL:

Why was that?

HOWARD KESTER:

Well, it was a natural, yet unnatural thing to do. Why not swap around a little bit? So I went to the President of our college, John Hundley and asked him if I could bring the Negroes from the college, Lynchburg Theological Seminary and College, over to our college for a concert, declamations and orations, and debates and this that or the other, you know, and he said, "Yes, go ahead," and I did. Most of the students and the faculty turned out as long as the Negro students were singing, and when they started the declamations, etc. they began to leave, a few of them, and I became un-stuck. I went to the door and I asked one or two of them, a particular fellow by the name of Stone, who said "I'll listen to a nigger sing," excuse the work but that's what he said, "but I ain't going to listen to them talk," and he kept going. Well, then we decided that we ought to find a white place to meet in. We went to the YWCA, central YWCA of Lynchburg and they were gracious and they welcomed us, but Lynchburg was a very conservative town, and it was no time at all until pressure began to be brought against the Directors and the Secretaries of the YWCA, so they had to say - "I'm sorry." They were, but we had to find new quarters.

JACQUELYN HALL:

You went to the YWCA instead of the YMCA?

HOWARD KESTER:

Lord have mercy, yes. You'd never get anything out of the YMCA.

JACQUELYN HALL:

I was just talking to Grace Towns Hamilton . . .

HOWARD KESTER:

I know Grace.

JACQUELYN HALL:

And she told me the same thing.

HOWARD KESTER:

The YWCA was always way ahead of the YMCA.

JACQUELYN HALL:

How do you account for that?

HOWARD KESTER:

Well, I think for one thing, they were more adventurous, and saw the agony through which Negroes were passing more quickly and deeply than did the "Y" Secretaries.