A belief in good behavior on the job, including staying out of a union
Norman remembers how much she disliked workers drinking on the job. Her employer lost a lot of money because of drinking, she believes. When the company erected a fence around the mill to prevent union infiltration, it also prevented workers from sneaking out to buy liquor on payday. Norman remembers that her loyalty to Spencer Love, her employer, stifled her interest in unionizing, but she was not rewarded for her loyalty in the long run. She was forced out of her job before she could work long enough to earn a pension.
Citing this Excerpt
Oral History Interview with Icy Norman, April 6 and 30, 1979. Interview H-0036. Southern Oral History Program Collection (#4007) in the Southern Oral History Program Collection, Southern Historical Collection, Wilson Library, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.
Full Text of the Excerpt
- MARY MURPHY:
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How long did it take you to begin to like the mill?
- ICY NORMAN:
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After I got to where I got up to drawing ten dollars a week I was well
satisfied. I liked it all right except on payday when they, them men,
would go to getting drunk. I didn't like that.
- MARY MURPHY:
-
Did the women get drunk?
- ICY NORMAN:
-
No, I never seen a woman up there drink. But the men would. I
don't know what it was they drunk or nothing about it. They
would have something they'd get drunk on. They'd
get so drunk they'd pass out. Them machines running. It was a
lot of waste. Spence Love lost a lot of money there on
account of the help, because the help didn't
care. A lot of places, all they care is eight hours and pay day. As far
as making perfect work, doing their job right and trying to improve
their job where it would make it easier on you to do your job, people
don't care. As I say all they look for is eight hours and
Friday, or whenever payday come, is all they care for. They
don't care nothing about their jobs. It's a many
and a many a person that's working like that. They
don't take no interest in it. But I did. I took an interest
in my job. And I'd study to see which would be the best and
which I thought would be the best for the company. I tried to keep my
job up. When I come out of that mill I was keeping two warp mills up on
cotton. Them other warp mills they had three or four hands in them,
creeling, and I kept two a running myself. It's just like I
said, a lot of people, they just don't care.
They'll lay down and let the work get behind. Next thing they
holler to the boss man, "I need some help." They could
go ahead and do it themselves if they was a mind to. So many people
ain't going to do that.
- MARY MURPHY:
-
How did they get things straightened out in the mill, how did they get
people to stop drinking?
- ICY NORMAN:
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I started to tell you. They come a union there. They was wanting to get
union in. Work was running bad. It was people that was working there
when work got bad would quit and go to other places. Then when the mill
boomed out they'd come back to the Burlington Mill.
That's the way it was. They put a fence around that mill and
they had a gate watchman. They took our picture. Couldn't
nobody go in that mill unless they had a picture on them. He looked at
your picture every time you went in, that gate watchman would.
- MARY MURPHY:
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This was after they tried to get a union?
- ICY NORMAN:
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No, that was before. We was wearing our pictures then with our
picture and number on it. After they put that
fence around there that stopped the drinking. They couldn't
run out and get it all during the night and day. But Jim Copland, he
would fire them. If he come through. He got so he'd go
through there of a night. I don't see how the poor fellow
stayed awake. He'd come through there of a night every two
hours. He'd go over to that mill every two hours.
- MARY MURPHY:
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He was there all day?
- ICY NORMAN:
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And he'd be there the next morning. I don't see how
in the world the man held it down. But he did. If he seen any of them a
drinking he'd fire them. Hire somebody and put in their
place. But everybody went in that mill, they had to learn their job for
nothing. But now in this day and time, people would laugh at you if you
said, "Well I'll give you a job if you want to learn
it. After you get learnt I'll pay you." They
wouldn't do it. No way could you get nobody to do that this
day and time. Then that was the only way you got a job with the
Burlington Mill. If you didn't already know how to do. If you
went in there to learn you learnt for nothing. And I really learnt for
nothing.
I stayed on with them. A lot of them would try to get me to quit when the
work was slack and go other places. I wouldn't do it. I
stayed right on with them. I know work was getting so bad, Spence Love
come down there and he look like he was so down and out. I said,
"Mr. Love, you look like you're mighty low this
morning."
He says, "I am. I'm just on rock bottom. I
don't know which way to do for the best. I'm going
to have to close the place down."
I says, "Well, there's always a brighter day a
coming. My mama told me that when I come here and I told you how bad I
hated this place. But I really love to work here now. It will be a
brighter day."
He says, "You really think so?"
I says, "Yes. It will be a brighter day. I'll stick
with you through thick and thin. If you sink, I'll go down
with you." I laughed and he got to laughing.
He says, "You just beat all I've ever seen."
Then it wasn't too long until that strike, they walked out.
Well, I think they was out, a week or two weeks. Some of them signed the
union and some of them didn't. I never did sign it. Time and
again since then they'd be out at the gate trying to
get— I believe a time or two after that they give them papers
out. And I think a time or two they did come in the mill and people
would go talk to them. If you wanted to sign, you signed. If you wanted
to not sign, you didn't sign.
- MARY MURPHY:
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You were never interested?
- ICY NORMAN:
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I never did sign.
- MARY MURPHY:
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How come?
- ICY NORMAN:
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I don't know. I just heard so much about the union, I thought
"I don't know whether it would pay or not."
I read the paper about people being out for months and months on strike.
I just didn't believe in it. If you was working and was
making money all that times you was out on strike, you would come out to
the end a whole lot better than you would be laying out maybe three and
four months at a time. So I never did sign it. So I stayed with the
Burlington Mill. I did everything they ever asked me to do. I always got
along with every boss man. I seen different bosses. In other words, I
seen overseers, bosses and second hands go and come. I always got along
with every one of them. I never did have one say a short word to me
because I always went and done what they would tell me to do. I do my
work as near right as I know how. And so I swung
with them for forty-seven years. I said, "Well, you knowed that
was in the making when I quit." I begged them to let me work on
but they wouldn't. They knowed it was in the making. They
could have let me work on until January. Then I could have got that big
profit sharing they all get now. It's five retired since I
did and they ain't been there the years I was there. I feel
like I was part in making the Burlington Industries, because I come
there and stayed with them, I went with them through thick and thin. In
other words, I give the best part of my life to the Burlington
Industries. It kind of hurt me to think that as long as I stayed there
and as faithful as I worked and all, that I didn't get none
of that profit that they…
- MARY MURPHY:
-
Was this a pension or a profit…
- ICY NORMAN:
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Well, you see, if you're there so many years and retire at
sixty-five you get $12,500.00. See, they knowed that was in the
making. They could have let me work on until January and I would have
got that. But my bosses and my supervisors, my second hand supervisor
and my superintendent, they had a meeting. They brought it up. They said
that I was part of the Burlington Mill, I helped found it. And I stuck
with them. They felt that I should have that. You know Klopman,
he's gone in the Burlington Mills. Old Klopman spoke up and
said, "No, if she's to get it, the ones that been
out two or three years wasn't entitled to it. Do you think
so?" And that's what my superintendent and overseers
and all—and Klopman said, "No they'd have
to come back."
That kind of hurt me, kind of hurt my feelings. I felt like I was part of
the Burlington Mill. Because Burlington Mill was nothing but a little
old two room plant when I went there.
- MARY MURPHY:
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What year was it you retired?
- ICY NORMAN:
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I retired in '76, first day of June. They let me work until
June. And my birthday was in April. I wanted to
work on but they wouldn't let me. But they could have let me
work from June until the first of January. It was five that retired
since, see I retired in June. They had a meeting after I retired and
explained it to them. It was five in January, February and March, all
five of them retired. All of five of them, I absolutely knowed, they
quit, and worked at other places three or four years and then come back
to the Burlington Mills. I still say they didn't do me right
over that. That was allright if that was the way they wanted it. I still
say I'd rather work at the Burlington plant than any other
place I heard of. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed my work. I took pride in my
work. I tried to get along with everybody. When I retired it was like
leaving my family, because I felt like they was all my family. I was
just with them day in and day out. They felt like my family. So that was
the way it was. Every time I go back up there I feel like I'm
going back home. [Laughter]