Well, we're on the firing line so to speak and I think for Black children
you are going to be--Black administrators are in a tough situation
because you are going to be seen by many Black kids as a part of a
system and some Black kids make an assumption that because you are in an
administrative position and even as a teacher that you are part of a
system and that the system opposes Black kids and there have been so
many things that have happened in our society to make Black parents
think that that is true and to know that it is true but we need Black
teachers and we need black administrators to influence our black
students so that they don't throw their lives away because I see so many
Black kids rebelling against the system that they don't really realize
that they are playing into the hands of those who say that Blacks can
not, will not be successful and I see so many young Black kids just
playing right into the hands so we need some Black teachers and Black
administrators to try to turn them around and that is a tough job as I
said because of your position you are going to be viewed as the enemy so
to speak. And that is a really, really tough job but I think once you
get in there and they see that you are sincere and they see that you can
help them, that you will help them, that that will turn around but there
are not enough of us now I don't think. So we ought to get some more
Blacks and that is getting harder and harder to do.
Just start over with one of the problems that I see for us and one thing
that concerns me for Black children and Black educators is an attitude
that some of our Black teachers have in a desegregated situation. A
feeling that more principals and especially Black principals will cater
to white teachers at their expense. And it has been difficult for me to
get our Black teachers involved in leadership roles that they ought to
be involved in for the benefit of our students to get them to serve as
advisors for clubs and organizations, to take the leadership for things
like American Education Week, to be in positions where they can
influence the number and the involvement of Black kids in extra
curricular activities which to me are just important as a formal
education because students get an opportunity to experience leadership
opportunities that will augment what they get in the classroom. But it
is difficult to get many of our Black teachers to give that extra time
in working with young Blacks or to work with the kids in general and
indirectly to help the Black students who need that. And then there is
an attitude toward Black principals. And I have talked to some other
Blacks and they've felt this too. A feeling that the Black teachers feel
that Black principals cater to White teachers. But it is a matter of if
you are trying to do something it is better to have people who volunteer
to do something than to make a person do something. And as a principal,
sometimes you can direct a person to take a responsibile but if they
don't have their heart in it it is not going to be successful. And I
would much rather have teachers who volunteer to
do something. But then when you call for volunteers the volunteers are
generally White. And then the Black teachers feel that well you let them
do everything. Well, it's not a matter of letting them do anything, it
is a matter of they volunteered to do it and my feeling is once again
that it is better to have a person to volunteer to do something and you
only result to appointing people when you can't get people who genuinely
want to do something. Did you notice a pattern where there was a Black
teacher in charge of a club or an advisor or club that you had more
Black participation.
Yes, you had more Black participation but you see my feeling was even
when I had Black and White teachers if it is a White advisor you are
going to have more White kids to gravitate, if it is a Black advisor
you're going to have more Blacks. But I would insist as much as I could
that we have equal participation on the part of Black and White kids.
Some of our Black teachers if they were in charge of something they
would stack it with Blacks because they said that was what White
teachers were doing and I was trying to get both sides to not do that. I
thought that it was important for the student body that every
organization in the school as much as you can without being totally
artificially to try to get Black, White and Asian kids to participate.
As a result my last year at Smith I started because I saw the need for
it again. I started the old Human Relations Committee that we had years
ago when integration first started. And while I opened it to all
students I went around and I spoke to Black, White, and Asian kids
because I was going to ensure that I had a broad spectrum of students.
And the funny thing when the other students saw this then kids would
volunteer. The Asian kids would feel comfortable coming because they
knew there were Asian kids and the Black kids felt comfortable and as a
result I got some good participation. But for some reason, it was hard
to get our teachers, some Black and White, to see that. That they did
not feel that they needed to make that special effort and I always did.
I used to say that you've got to guarantee success and you guarantee
success by doing some little behind the scene things to make sure that
whatever you're trying to do is successful and let's face it. We've been
integrated here in Greensboro twenty years but our students still come
from homes and they come largely from neighborhoods that are still
segregated. So if we don't do things in the schools to let the kids see
that it is all right to be involved with Black kids outside the
classroom and it is all right to be involved with White kids outside the
classroom. We have to model that and the same thing in the cafeteria. It
used to bother me to go the cafeteria and look at one end of the teacher
table. All the teachers would congregate. One end would be White and one
end would be Black. And I talk about that in faculty meeting. I can't
make you all be friends but I think we need to model some things for our
kids. How can we ask the kids to get along, Black
and White, when they can look at us and while they don't see us fighting
they can see that something isn't quite right and those kinds of things
I think are important but there are a lot of teachers, Black and White,
who don't feel that that is their responsibility. And I do feel that it
is their responsibility. I think using a seating chart in a classroom.
One reason I think the teachers used to use seating charts is to
separate the "bad eggs". But I like to use seating charts because I want
to integrate the classroom. I don't like to walk into a classroom and
see the Black kids sitting on one side and the White kids sitting on
another side. Once again, this is America. People are free to sit where
they want to sit and that is true but once again I think that the school
system is the place that this country is going to be changed. If we
don't have the right people in the leadership and positions in the
schools then it is going to take longer to happen. But then some kids
are smarter than some of the adults. They do it on their own. But once
again, you can't expect a student to come from a situation, a
neighborhood that is segregated, a segregated church, segregated every
phase of their life except school and then expect them to all of a
sudden integrate and have friends of the opposite race. But I think if
we set up situations where they get to know each other then I think the
country is going to change.